[nagdu] EXTERNAL:Re: choosing a school

Thu Aug 26 14:26:18 UTC 2010

All I can say is " AMEN!". You understand perfectly.
Daniel and Scout

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Tamara Smith-Kinney
Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 4:23 PM
To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
Subject: Re: [nagdu] EXTERNAL:Re: choosing a school

Dan,

Well, as someone who decided to owner-train *instead* of going to a school,
I can assure that learning to trust the dog you've worked so hard to turn
into a guide dog you can trust is not as easy as it sound.  /smile/  Even
when you know intellectually that the dog is trained and ready, even when
you know the proper things to do and commands to give, and all the education
is done...  Setting out with your guide dog, of which you are now the
handler, not the trainer, is cause for a major head trip.  /grin/

I thought I would *never* get past myself.  Good grief!  Mitzi had to have a
lot of patience with me and teach me how to do things right. 

I had a much harder time training myself -- especially training myself to
relax and let my dog do her job -- than I did in training the dog.  I hasn't
really been that long that my dog and go set off to where we want to go like
we're a team or something.  /grin/  It is fun when it happens.  Takes a lot
of stubborn determination to get there.

Tami Smith-Kinney

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Dan Sweeney
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2010 2:30 PM
To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
Subject: Re: [nagdu] EXTERNAL:Re: choosing a school

If I could answer that with a clear and precise answer, I would. I guess I
felt like a failure if I could not get everything under control by myself..
I had an instant love affair with this dog, he's an old English lab, so,
everyone says he is the most beautiful lab they have ever seen.
>From the time I got him home he was  perfect inside, it was outside that
was
the problem. When I FINALLY received some help from LD, the trainer takes
him out, and says there was absolutely nothing wrong with the dog.
At the same time, he tells me it was a bad match, and I should have never
left the school with that dog.
At this point I had the dog for over 6 months - and I was not about to have
him say nothing was wrong with dog and take him back after 6 months.
I even had a regular dog trainer work with me for a couple of months.
Determination is what I had, but it has caused so much depression at the
same time.
Another trainer was out a couple months ago, and I really don't know what
she thought. She saw that I was still very tense with dog, so I am working
on trust, and so far, so good.
Long answer for a short question, sorry.

Daniel and Scout

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Pickrell, Rebecca M (TASC)
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2010 12:03 PM
To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Subject: Re: [nagdu] EXTERNAL:Re: choosing a school

Dan, 
I'd be curious to know why you worked so hard with Scout. Why did you
not have him be apet and get another dog from whatever source? 
I have to say, I'm proud of you. 

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Tamara Smith-Kinney
Sent: Friday, August 20, 2010 1:08 PM
To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
Subject: EXTERNAL:Re: [nagdu] choosing a school

Dan,

Hey!  I remember now reading about your trials and frustrations, then
being
afraid for you when we stopped hearing from you here.  Honestly, I
didn't
know if I was afraid for you because of safety problems with your dog or
because of the less obvious injuries it sounds like you did receive as
the
price for having poblems and not getting the assistance and support you
needed. So sorry you had to go through that.  I've wondered off and on
how
it came out.  I am so glad you got it resolved and were about to work
through the problems with Scout, since that was what you chose to do.

Of course, you did not choose to owner train, did you?  /smile/  Sigh.
Every now and then I still have someone who knows all about how guide
dogs
are tell me that what I really need to do is go to a place where they
train
guide dogs and have them teach me how to use the one they've trained for
me,
so I wouldn't be having these problems...  Mitzi is a nice pet and all,
but...  "These problems" in the context tend to be the problem of
Mitzi's
looking around while she's in harness, or not sitting down on the spot
when
someone tells her to (I almost never do, and then only because I forget
to
use "rest" or "settle" instead, since I don't want her sitting on
something
I didn't see that might be messy), or...  Well, she walks too fast and
is
going to get me hurt by running me into something dragging me along the
way
she does.  I have one friend in particular who is always fretting about
how
she wishes Mitzi would learn to stop pulling on the harness when we're
walking.  And that she would mind better -- which tends to mean that she
would mind other people who give her commands while she's working for
me.
Or ...  Well, we all know real guide dogs don't stop to sniff *ever* and
that real guide dog handlers are taught how to handle sniffing! /grin/

Your case is one of think of, as well as some others, when people go on
about the perfection of real guide dogs.  And how a school would be able
to
fix all of these problems I'm having with my pretend guide dog and would
teach me how to use the dog properly so I wouldn't have these problems
and
when I did have problems, the school could send someone out to fix them
for
me...  I've heard a few other miraculous things a proper school would do
for
me that would be really nice, but I can't remember what they are
because,
well, I find them delightfully absurd, then forget about them.

Welcome back to you and Scout, and I wish you many safe travels together
in
the future.

Tami Smith-Kinney

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf
Of Dan Sweeney
Sent: Friday, August 20, 2010 9:15 AM
To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
Subject: [nagdu] choosing a school

Hi Mark,

I have been reading all the posts about which school to choose. If this
is
your first dog, I would certainly take recommendations from those on
this
list who have received multiple dogs, or those who have received their
first
dog - and have excellent follow-up training if it was required (in a
timely
manner).

I received my first dog 2 years ago this month. I have just applied for
ownership, so you know what school I got my dog from.

When I needed the help the most - when I returned home - there was no
trainer to work with me in the foreseeable future. It was not until
January
until I received any personal assistance from the school. I would have
expected more. Instead I drove myself crazy working with my dog, with
many
resulting injuries to myself. My confidence turned into deep depression,
none of my friends wanted to help me because they thought I should have
just
returned the dog and tell the school to shove it. The idea did cross my
mind, but my heart was already captured by this dog. I don't know why,
it
just was.

My next training visit was June of this year. I admit I did not get on
the
phone and say "get someone out here now, or you can take this dog back",
but
I was on the phone asking for assistance.

I would have appreciated more training at the school, meaning smaller
class
size per instructor, and certainly more one on one follow-up, especially
when I got home, especially since it was my first dog and I was having
such
problems.

I would keep these two things in mind when you are applying to a school,
and
SPEAK UP if you feel you are not comfortable with the training you are
receiving.

Two years is a long time to have spent "training" a dog when I got home,
but
I am glad I stuck it out. We are finally as stubborn as each other. LOL.

I do not recommend what I went through.

Daniel and Scout

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