[nagdu] EXTERNAL: Puppy raising

Jordan Frances Ortiz ortizj32 at students.rowan.edu
Fri Jul 30 19:57:39 UTC 2010


Pickrell, Rebecca M (TASC) wrote:
> Doesn't being required to show ID take us down the path of what the
> NAZIs did? 
> If that was a requirement, I'd never use a guide or service dog again.
> I'd be worried about what precident that sets, as well as what
> information was contained on the card. Who would get to see it and what
> would they do with that information. 
> I don't understand why raisers can't ask permission to take their pups
> places. Also, nonworking dogs aren't comitted to only going to Petsmart.
> Parades are a great experience, as are outdoor cafes, (my neck of the
> woods is full of such places) and any number of other oppertunities
> exist. 
> Given the example Jordan sites, the lady n the bus didn't sneak her dog
> on, if you knew about it, everybody else did too. Why didn't you call
> the bus company and point out the discrpenacy? 
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Jordan Frances Ortiz
> Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2010 11:11 PM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] EXTERNAL: Puppy raising
>
> As Danielle's Co-Raiser, rommmate, and friend I'd have to agree.  If we 
> only took our puppies to pet friendly areas they would not receive the 
> exposure handlers require.  I am a Seeing Eye dog handler and raiser.  
> Viola is my Seeing eye dog, and I appreciate all the exposure her 
> raisers gave her.  We have taken our puppies everywhere, and I have no 
> problem asking for permission.  For those who think that raising puppies
>
> should not be allowed in areas that only service dogs are allowed I have
>
> to aks a question.  what would you do if your dog started backing down 
> open stairs or planting their paws when they see a strange statue?  How 
> would you correct shaking at a parade or cowering from children.
>
> We as raisers work hard every minute of everyday to make all of the 
> harness dogs have a smooth working experience.  These puppies need the 
> exposure to as much as possible, or when they get with their handlers 
> they will freeze up.  I believe that if there were to be new laws passed
>
> that puppies and service dogs should be required to show ID when 
> entering public places.  I feel this will inconvenience our lives, but 
> it will cut down all people snaeaking in pets as service puppies or
> dogs.
>
> Nothing annoys me mor ethan when I get on a transit bus that doesn't 
> allow pets with my guide dog and puppy and there is a women on the bus 
> with a yappy dog in her purse.  "Its my service dog"  right... sorry for
>
> the rant, but this stuff means a lot to me.
>
> Jordan and Viola
>
>
>
>
> Danielle Nicole Larsen wrote:
>   
>> Hi Everyone!
>> First, a quick introduction as I'm not a frequent poster on this list.
>>     
> My
>   
>> name is Danielle, and I'm a Seeing Eye puppy raiser. I've also been 
>> accepted
>> to get a guide from TSE and am in the process of making that decision.
>>     
>
>   
>> I'm a
>> senior at Rowan University in New Jersey.
>>
>> Firstly, I feel that puppy in training access rights is far from a
>>     
> waste.
>   
>> There is a very important reason puppies need to go places. For 
>> exposure. If
>> puppies can't go anywhere they are going to have significant surprise
>> reactins much more often in harness. As a puppy raiser it's our job to
>> ensure they have seen it all, and reacted successfully to it all by 
>> the time
>> they are ready for training.
>> The puppy that I work with most often now has gone all over, and we 
>> haven't
>> had huge access problems. And that is fortuante but not always the 
>> case. If
>> they dont' get out, they don't recieve exposure and don't know how to 
>> work
>> in harness. If you are a guide dog handler I'm certian you would not
>>     
> want
>   
>> your pup to have only been to pets mart or a dog park
>>
>> Secondly, The Seeing Eye, the shcool I raise for I'm sure your all 
>> familar
>> with, doesn't want the puppies at dog parks and things of the like.
>>     
> These
>   
>> places have dogs of all types that may not all have thier 
>> vaccinations. So
>> not all pet friendly places are puppy appropriate.
>>
>> I honestly believe that it should be required for a puppy raiser to
>>     
> have
>   
>> their pup wearing identifying attire and present ID at each place. But
>>     
> I
>   
>> think that if that is followed, access should be granted via laws.
>> Eventually. Right now things are okay. But with that law things could
>>     
> be
>   
>> much better. The more places a puppy can go, the more ready they are 
>> for the
>> working world. And in no way could that EVER be viewed as bad!
>>
>> As a puppy raiser I made the commitment to the work that goes into it.
>>     
>
>   
>> And I
>> have loved every single second, both good and bad, of it. There is not
>>     
>
>   
>> one
>> moment I would take back. I understand calling places ahead of time is
>>     
>
>   
>> part
>> of the deal. And it's not a problem for me. It's what I committed to 
>> do by
>> working with this puppy. But that doesn't mean that having the laws 
>> wouldn't
>> help. Any chance at exposure as far as I'm concerned is a good one. 
>> And if
>> the laws were able to support that I think it would make a difference.
>>
>> I'll step off my soapbox now!
>> =)
>>
>> -D
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pickrell, Rebecca M (TASC)" 
>> <REBECCA.PICKRELL at tasc.com>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2010 12:39 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] EXTERNAL: Puppy raising
>>
>>
>>     
>>> Meghan,
>>> Thank you for this. Probably people think that you're training the
>>>       
> pup
>   
>>> to replace your current guide. Or, they just like you or like one or
>>> both dogs. Nothing wrong with that.
>>> I'm glad you have the rights in Wisconsin, I just don't think giving
>>> access rights v. privileges to puppies in training is a good use of
>>> resources. NFB and the other blindness and service dog organizations
>>> still have a lot to do with regard to access issues for working
>>>       
> teams.
>   
>>> I'd rather see oure fferts go toward that end given that puppy
>>>       
> raisers
>   
>>> are able to both ask permission as well as frequent pet friendly
>>>       
> places
>   
>>> and activities.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>> Behalf Of Meghan Whalen
>>> Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2010 11:45 AM
>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] EXTERNAL: Puppy raising
>>>
>>> That is a very good question, and one I really can't answer.  I just
>>> know
>>> that in Wisconsin, dogs in training are granted the same access
>>>       
> rights,
>   
>>> as
>>> long as they behave.  I am honestly a little bit surprised that I
>>> haven't
>>> been challenged for having two dogs with me, but I will cross that
>>> bridge if
>>> I come upon it.
>>>
>>> I would have no issues with calling ahead to see if I could bring my
>>> puppy
>>> in training with me, if that was what the law required, but it is
>>>       
> very
>   
>>> nice
>>> to know that he can come in everywhere.
>>>
>>> Meghan
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pickrell, Rebecca M (TASC)" 
>>> <REBECCA.PICKRELL at tasc.com>
>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2010 10:22 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] EXTERNAL: Puppy raising
>>>
>>>
>>>       
>>>> Hi Meghan. The way you explain the leaving and coming back makes
>>>>         
>>> sense.
>>>       
>>>> You're teaching a very defined skill, unlike with parents who teach
>>>>         
>>> "how
>>>       
>>>> to be a good person" which is very different. In your situation,
>>>>         
>>> you're
>>>       
>>>> trying to stop the dog from barking and you reintroduced the
>>>>         
> situation
>   
>>>> quickly so the good behavior was reinforced.
>>>> My problem with the "just leave if the dog acts up" is that it
>>>>         
> teaches
>   
>>>> the dog that if it is just tired of working, all it need do is act
>>>>         
> up.
>   
>>>> Your explamation sounds like it teaches the correct behavior v. the
>>>> incorrect one. In fairness, this can be very difficult to keep in
>>>>         
>>> mind.
>>>       
>>>> I'm still not sure why service dogs in training need the rights that
>>>> guide dog users do. Your thoughts? I guess I don't understand why
>>>>         
>>> asking
>>>       
>>>> for permission and sticking to dog-friendly places wouldn't be
>>>>         
> enough?
>   
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>>> Behalf Of Tracy Carcione
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2010 10:36 AM
>>>> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>> Subject: EXTERNAL:[nagdu] Puppy raising
>>>>
>>>> Hi Meghan.
>>>> I would be extremely interested to hear more about your
>>>>         
> puppy-raising
>   
>>>> experiences.  You have a guide dog, too, don't you?  How does that
>>>>         
>>> work?
>>>       
>>>> Or are you between dogs?Tell us all about your puppy!
>>>> Tracy
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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> for
>   
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>>>>         
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/rebecca.pickrell%
>   
>>>> 40ngc.com
>>>>
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>>> com
>>>       
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>   
Hey Rebecca:

I wasn't trying to say that puppies aren't allowed in places.  I thought 
that in your previous email you were trying tosay the puppies in 
training shouldn't be allowed anywhere except pet friendly areas.  I was 
just trying to say that puppies need exposure to everywhere, and when 
they go into harness I think it helps them out a lot.  the more exposure 
the better.

for Id's for puppies and guides I have an Id from Seeing Eye allready 
for Viola.  It just says the school she's from, My name, viola's name, 
and her picture on it.  I love puppy raising and by signing up to do 
this I'm willing to ask permission to go everywhere with our puppy.  I 
was just saying that if there was ever a way to allow puppies in without 
having to ask permission that would be awesome.  It has becoem part of 
my life to ask permission for our puppy so I really am not complaining.  
sorry if you took me to having an attitude I must have read your email 
wrong.
Jordan and Viola




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