[nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby

Larry D. Keeler lkeeler at comcast.net
Sat Nov 12 02:02:33 UTC 2011 

Aggreed!
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Natalie" <nrorrell at qwest.net>
To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, November 11, 2011 8:09 PM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby


> Hi Larry,
> Gosh, I hate when people have those kind of biases.  Fortunately, most 
> everyone I associate is pretty open-minded.  But should I encounter 
> someone who may appear to be biased toward schools for only God knows why, 
> my response would be that there's good and bad in every school.
> Best,
> Nat and Liam Joshua
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Larry D. Keeler" <lkeeler at comcast.net>
> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2011 5:11 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>
>
>> Sheila, I too thaught that NFB just was about raising Hell!  Well, we do 
>> some of that but we also aren't afraid to challenge those who need to be 
>> challenged!  We can also challenge by example.  For instance, I sat next 
>> to the representive from Leader Dogs.  I talked to her about there 
>> programs and had quite a conversation with her.  She thaught Holly was 
>> from her school because she was so well behaved and was really surprised 
>> to find out she was from Pilot.  Knowing the bias some folks have towards 
>> schools, I didn't say anything until she asked.
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Sheila Leigland" <sleigland at bresnan.net>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2011 5:19 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>
>>
>>> That was definetely a part of the reason that I wasnn't interested in 
>>> nagdu for a long time because I didn't want to belong to an organization 
>>> that didnn't agree with my right and responsibility to choose my method 
>>> of mobility aid a dog or  a cane. I always at least at one time believed 
>>> that the nfb believed that blind people were capable of making there own 
>>> choices and when I thought that it wasn't accurate i wanted nothing to 
>>> do with the nfb. I've since to a large degree changed my mind about this 
>>> thanks to your cooperation concerning easter seals and my work 
>>> relationship and the use of my dog and this list.
>>>
>>> Sheila Leigland
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Marion Gwizdala <blind411 at verizon.net>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2011 6:37 AM
>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users 
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>
>>> Larry,
>>>    One reason you may not know of many guide dog users friendly to the 
>>> NFB
>>> is because there are those who would like guide dog users to believe 
>>> that
>>> the NFB is anti guide dog. I am of the opinion that, once guide dog 
>>> users
>>> realize this is a myth, we will see a growth in our ranks. many are a 
>>> part
>>> of the other organization even though they do not agree with its 
>>> philosophy
>>> or approach simply because they have been convinced of this myth. They 
>>> would
>>> rather be a part of a consumer's group with which they have some
>>> philosophical disagreements than none at all. I believe that, once guide 
>>> dog
>>> users see that the National Association of Guide Dog Users is the 
>>> leading
>>> force in the affairs of guide dog users and is taking a proactive 
>>> approach
>>> to enhancing their lives, they will realize they have been betrayed by 
>>> these
>>> lies and come stand on the barricades with us!
>>>
>>> Fraternally yours,
>>> Marion Gwizdala
>>>
>>>
>>> this issue
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Larry D. Keeler" <lkeeler at comcast.net>
>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 8:42 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>
>>>
>>>> Marion, one reason I don't know of many Grand Rapids dog users is 
>>>> because
>>>> NFB is sort of weak in that area.  They have the state ACB President 
>>>> there
>>>> and he is pretty strong over there!  I saw no dog users in Kalamazoo or
>>>> for that matter from the whole west coast!  They are probably there
>>>> though!
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "Marion Gwizdala" <blind411 at verizon.net>
>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 7:07 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Sheila, This is why we have NAGDU and the NAGDU Information & advocacy
>>>>> Hotline. It is my hope we can find a NAGDU person in the Grand Rapids
>>>>> area willing to take this on and press it to the end!
>>>>>
>>>>> Fraternally yours,
>>>>> Marion
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>> From: "Sheila Leigland" <sleigland at bresnan.net>
>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 5:02 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Marion it is so sad and wrong that this stuff still goes on in this
>>>>>> country The manager or whatever she is definetely knows the law and
>>>>>> chooses to ignore it. I'm glad that I didnn't realize how much the 
>>>>>> laws
>>>>>> are ignored when I got my first dog. I thought that the law was the 
>>>>>> law
>>>>>> and I believed it would be upheld. I hope that if I had known reality
>>>>>> that I still would have wanted a guide dog and would have known how 
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> stand up for myself as a blind person.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sheila Leigland
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: Marion Gwizdala <blind411 at verizon.net>
>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 2:26 PM
>>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Naw! That would be too good a place for them! (grin) I prefer a 10 X 
>>>>>> 10
>>>>>> cell
>>>>>> with a 350-pound biker named Bubba whose brother is blind and uses a
>>>>>> guide
>>>>>> dog! (smile) Now, that's justice!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Marion
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Marion
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>> From: "Larry D. Keeler" <lkeeler at comcast.net>
>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 3:57 PM
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And that could be in a dog shelter with a bunch of shedding fur!
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>> From: "Marion Gwizdala" <blind411 at verizon.net>
>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog 
>>>>>>> Users"
>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 2:37 PM
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Julie,
>>>>>>>>    Although a cash fine would be good, incarceration would be even
>>>>>>>> sweeter in this case!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Marion
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>> From: "Julie J." <julielj at neb.rr.com>
>>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog 
>>>>>>>> Users"
>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 11:46 AM
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> What I think would work even better is rounding up every
>>>>>>>>> service/guide
>>>>>>>>> dog user in a 100 mile radius and going together to eat there.  Of
>>>>>>>>> course having along a news reporter makes the event that much more
>>>>>>>>> memorable.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And I agree there need to be cash fines for this sort of behavior.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Julie
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 11/8/2011 10:27 AM, Brenda wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> This is one of those times when I wonder if picketing and
>>>>>>>>>> encouraging
>>>>>>>>>> the public to boycott would work.  Maybe the local citizens could 
>>>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>>>> encouraged to boycott this establishmebnt every Friday and tell 
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> manager WHY.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 11/8/2011 11:01 AM, Buddy Brannan wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Dan,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> IMO, the time for being nice and educating is long past. It's 
>>>>>>>>>>> time
>>>>>>>>>>> we
>>>>>>>>>>> start to insist that some teeth be put into the laws that 
>>>>>>>>>>> protect
>>>>>>>>>>> our
>>>>>>>>>>> rights. Unfortunately, the only thing some people understand
>>>>>>>>>>> (including, it would appear, this manager) is something that 
>>>>>>>>>>> hits
>>>>>>>>>>> them
>>>>>>>>>>> in the pocketbook. It's pretty clear to me that she even knows
>>>>>>>>>>> she's
>>>>>>>>>>> in the wrong and doesn't care, as she wouldn't give her name 
>>>>>>>>>>> even
>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>> back up her stance.
>>>>>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>>>>>> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>>>>>>>>>>> Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Nov 8, 2011, at 10:50 AM, Dan Weiner wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I would like to see that restaurant go out of business.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Dan
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org 
>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>>>>>>>>>> On
>>>>>>>>>>>> Behalf
>>>>>>>>>>>> Of Ginger Kutsch
>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 10:42 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog 
>>>>>>>>>>>> Users
>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Frank Eckl goes everywhere with Spruce
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Published : Monday, 07 Nov 2011,
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> By Leon Hendrix
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> CASCADE TOWNSHIP, Mich. (WOOD) - Frank Eckl and his family -- 
>>>>>>>>>>>> including his
>>>>>>>>>>>> service dog -- went to dinner Saturday night at Don Julio's
>>>>>>>>>>>> restaurant in
>>>>>>>>>>>> Cascade Township. But the manager said the dog had to stay in 
>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> lobby.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Eckl told 24 Hour News 8 he takes the dog with him wherever he
>>>>>>>>>>>> goes.
>>>>>>>>>>>> He uses
>>>>>>>>>>>> the dog because of a disability he has that causes occasional
>>>>>>>>>>>> seizures. When
>>>>>>>>>>>> he's alone, it's his service dog Spruce that calls for help and
>>>>>>>>>>>> helps
>>>>>>>>>>>> him
>>>>>>>>>>>> get up if he's fallen to the ground.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> He said he's never had a problem bringing Spruce with him since
>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> law
>>>>>>>>>>>> allows it.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> But the manager at Don Julio's wouldn't allow the dog in the
>>>>>>>>>>>> dining
>>>>>>>>>>>> area.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> "She [the manager] said we were more than welcome to stay, but
>>>>>>>>>>>> patrons in
>>>>>>>>>>>> the restaurant and the manager didn't want dog hair in the
>>>>>>>>>>>> restaurant," he
>>>>>>>>>>>> said. "I was shocked that we were asked to have the dog leave 
>>>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>>> we
>>>>>>>>>>>> could
>>>>>>>>>>>> stay."
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> The manager-on-duty admitted they insisted the dog stay in the
>>>>>>>>>>>> entrance way
>>>>>>>>>>>> to the restaurant, and that she would make the same request it
>>>>>>>>>>>> again
>>>>>>>>>>>> She
>>>>>>>>>>>> said patrons at the restaurant complained about the dog and 
>>>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>>>>>> opted
>>>>>>>>>>>> to leave because of sanitation concerns.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> "I asked for him to bring the dog out to the main entrance to 
>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> lobby,"
>>>>>>>>>>>> the manager said. She refused to provide her name to 24 Hour 
>>>>>>>>>>>> News
>>>>>>>>>>>> 8.
>>>>>>>>>>>> "I
>>>>>>>>>>>> didn't ask for him to take his dog back home, to take his dog 
>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> car or
>>>>>>>>>>>> leave him outside in the middle of the parking lot at all."
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Eckl and his family simply left the restaurant and went to the
>>>>>>>>>>>> IHOP
>>>>>>>>>>>> restaurant next door, where they were welcomed with Spruce.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Others that use service dogs have been asked to comply by the 
>>>>>>>>>>>> same
>>>>>>>>>>>> rules
>>>>>>>>>>>> without complaint, the manager at Don Julio's said.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> "I can't keep every customer happy," she said, adding that she 
>>>>>>>>>>>> was
>>>>>>>>>>>> aware
>>>>>>>>>>>> that Spruce was a service dog but didn't realize it was Eckl 
>>>>>>>>>>>> who
>>>>>>>>>>>> used
>>>>>>>>>>>> him.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> "I knew it was not for him. He didn't tell me the service dog 
>>>>>>>>>>>> was
>>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>> him...
>>>>>>>>>>>> He wasn't clear to me either."
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Jocelyn Dettloff, a representative for the Disability Advocates 
>>>>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>>> Kent
>>>>>>>>>>>> County, said the violation is more serious than unhappy 
>>>>>>>>>>>> customers
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>
>>
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>
>
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