[nagdu] Email Forwarding was Re: Advice Requested

Nicole B. Torcolini at Home ntorcolini at wavecable.com
Sat Jan 21 22:28:00 UTC 2012 

Most email servers allow you to forward to another address and then there is 
an option as to whether the server keeps a copy or deletes it. Even if the 
server does not delete it, you could delete it by hand. If your server will 
not forward, you can forward yourself; the forwarded email still contains 
all headers and other important information from the original message. Also, 
when a server forwards to another address, it still shows as being sent to 
the original address.
    I am not saying that you have to use this method.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark J. Cadigan" <kramc11 at gmail.com>
To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 2:22 PM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advice Requested


> The forwarding part yes, the deleting part no. I forward it anyway, I just 
> don't know if a forwarded email has any legal bearing.
>
>
>
> Part of why my school emails are automatically forwarded is so I know that 
> I will have a copy no madder what happens.
>
>
>
> You know how computer systems can conveniently crash and whatnot.
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Nicole B. Torcolini at Home" <ntorcolini at wavecable.com>
> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 5:12 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advice Requested
>
>
>> Can you forward it to your gmail account and then delete it from the 
>> school server?
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Mark J. Cadigan" <kramc11 at gmail.com>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 12:55 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advice Requested
>>
>>
>>>I do document everything, but I am probably going to do that by asking 
>>>him to send me a written confirmation of what we agree on, or recording 
>>>the meeting.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> What I am trying to do is avoid the documentation being held on the 
>>> school's servers. This does not sound like a good place to keep it if 
>>> you ask me. Perhaps if he would email me at my gmail account, however he 
>>> only emails me at my school email.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I was only informed about his inspection after the fact, and did not 
>>> have an opportunity to go on his inspection with him.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Lisa belville" <missktlab1217 at frontier.com>
>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 3:46 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advice Requested
>>>
>>>
>>>> Okay, I don't blame you for not tagging along.  , although I'd be 
>>>> curious to see how this person acted in your presence if there were 
>>>> also sighted witnesses.  Plus you're not being there could be 
>>>> misinterpreted as you not wanting to solve the problem.
>>>>
>>>> Those of us who have had situations with our dogs in the past are 
>>>> offering advice from experience rather than speculation.  I understand 
>>>> why you don't want to be seen as adversarial, but documenting Emails 
>>>> and conversations in this situation isn't adversarial, it's you 
>>>> protecting yourself.  They might interpret it as you being defensive or 
>>>> confrontational, but a lawyer would see otherwise.  Keeping things off 
>>>> the record might work at first, but it sounds like this person isn't 
>>>> interested in sticking to the law, this is why I say document, 
>>>> document, document.
>>>>
>>>> Believe me, the more proof you have that you're trying to work the 
>>>> problem out and are being thwarted by one person's misinterpretation of 
>>>> the law the easier it will be to go over their head.  It could be that 
>>>> their superior has no clue anything is going on.
>>>>
>>>> Good luck, and let us know how it turns out.
>>>>
>>>> I'll try anything once, especially if it's chocolate covered!
>>>>
>>>> Lisa Belville
>>>> missktlab1217 at frontier.com
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "Mark J. Cadigan" <kramc11 at gmail.com>
>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 1:36 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advice Requested
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>I was not with him when he made the inspection. I had better things to 
>>>>>do with my life besides analyze doggy skid marks.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> He can love me or hate me, and I don't really care. He just got to 
>>>>> know that when pushed, I swing back and hit hard.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> My point of asking this on list besides simply venting is if he 
>>>>> attempts to pursue this any stronger than grumbling at me, what is my 
>>>>> recourse. What if anything can he due to me and how can I defend 
>>>>> myself against it. I am talking in the legal and school rules realms 
>>>>> hear, I have no fears that he would try anything other than 
>>>>> administrative punishment.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>> From: "Lisa belville" <missktlab1217 at frontier.com>
>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 1:34 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advice Requested
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hmm, Interesting.  so the ODS director not only polices the college's 
>>>>>> property, but property that technically doesn't belong to the 
>>>>>> college? What then does this presumably educated person do when it 
>>>>>> comes to actual work? Getting paid to be outside looking for doggie 
>>>>>> skid marks seems a bit below someone with an advanced degree, but 
>>>>>> stranger things have happened.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ?  And yes, that was sarcasm.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I agree with the person who suggested that you get a sighted person 
>>>>>> to photograph the area.  When the director is pointing out these 
>>>>>> spots, do you have someone there who can confirm or deny the 
>>>>>> allegations or do you go out there alone with this person
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Surely people with other service dogs are missing spots here and 
>>>>>> there. Even fully sighted people don't get every single shred when 
>>>>>> they pick up, assuming they pick up.  Plus those using dogs for work 
>>>>>> like bracing or door opening may not be in a position to physically 
>>>>>> pick up after their dog, so how do they deal with this?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I guess what I'm asking here is whether or not this director has an 
>>>>>> issue with service dogs in general or with you specifically.  The 
>>>>>> more I read, I have to wonder if it's some beef, real or imagined 
>>>>>> that this person has with you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Does your college have a disabled students club or some kind of 
>>>>>> social networking aspect specific to those with disabilities?  It 
>>>>>> might be worth it to go this route to at least learn whether or not 
>>>>>> you're being singled out. Even if this person isn't singling you out, 
>>>>>> this behavior is way over the top, IMO.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lisa
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'll try anything once, especially if it's chocolate covered!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lisa Belville
>>>>>> missktlab1217 at frontier.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>> From: "Mark J. Cadigan" <kramc11 at gmail.com>
>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 12:02 PM
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advice Requested
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yes, the director of the ODS office made a dog dropping inspection, 
>>>>>>> and counted "no less than 8 skid marks on the pavement.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't know who his boss is.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The security guards love my dog. I don't think it is them.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>> From: "Robert Hooper" <hooper.90 at buckeyemail.osu.edu>
>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog 
>>>>>>> Users" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 12:35 PM
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advice Requested
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You shouldn't have to do that.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Who, specifically, is giving you the hard time? Do you have people 
>>>>>>>> from ODS following you around everywhere? Who is telling them that 
>>>>>>>> it is your dog--could it be the aforementioned security guards in 
>>>>>>>> your dorm filing complaints? If so, they may make it sound a lot 
>>>>>>>> worse than it really is--the ODS people may be being told that 
>>>>>>>> there are massive chunks of doggy dung lying around instead of the 
>>>>>>>> occasional mustard blot. I just don't see how ODS would even know 
>>>>>>>> about your dog's relieving behavior. ODS at my school isn't 
>>>>>>>> interested in the slightest that I even have a dog, let alone when 
>>>>>>>> and where it poops. This situation is astonishing to me because of 
>>>>>>>> that. When I stroll into ODS, I get nothing but the occasional 
>>>>>>>> compliment about my "pretty shepherd" and then it's on to business. 
>>>>>>>> Has somebody from ODS been out there to check the specific spot? 
>>>>>>>> You should demand that they clean it up since their expertise about 
>>>>>>>> dog care knows no bounds. You should also inform them that you are 
>>>>>>>> a grown human being who managed to pass through a college admission 
>>>>>>>> screening process and that their attitude is disgusting, 
>>>>>>>> condescending, and appropriate toward a nine-year-old, not a 
>>>>>>>> competent individual such as yourself who strives to one day soon 
>>>>>>>> have a degree in hand. Ask them if they also want to monitor your 
>>>>>>>> pooping behavior and ensure that you are flushing after each #2 you 
>>>>>>>> make. Ask them also if they plan on eating a four course meal from 
>>>>>>>> the pavement in question, because if so, then there is a lot more 
>>>>>>>> that needs done to clean it up than Mr. Clean. Tell them that if 
>>>>>>>> they are going to treat you like a child, then you want them to 
>>>>>>>> also go after the drunks that puke on the pavement; those who 
>>>>>>>> urinate on the pavement; those who throw trash or food on the 
>>>>>>>> pavement; those who spit their gum on the pavement. Ask them if 
>>>>>>>> they care where your dog goes when you are at home because your 
>>>>>>>> home is just as off-campus as the place you take your dog when you 
>>>>>>>> are at school. Finally, demand of this person to see their 
>>>>>>>> supervisor, to whom you will say the same things until somebody 
>>>>>>>> decides to get off their power trip and treat you like you're the 
>>>>>>>> college student that you are, not their wayward naughty child.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sorry for the rant, but people and situations like that disgust, 
>>>>>>>> sicken, and sadden me. Of course, you probably shouldn't spout all 
>>>>>>>> that to anyone. At least make it sound more diplomatic first. 
>>>>>>>> However, I assure you that if it were me, that would be the overall 
>>>>>>>> impression I would try to leave with them. Whether they have a 
>>>>>>>> fancy policy about dog dung or not, it can't apply off-campus--no 
>>>>>>>> matter how close to campus it is--off campus is off campus. Period. 
>>>>>>>> It would be the equivalent of them saying "Clean up more carefully 
>>>>>>>> after your dog when you're at your mother's house. Otherwise, there 
>>>>>>>> will be consequences for you." Anyway, I hope you get that 
>>>>>>>> resolved. Don't hesitate to inform them of their deplorable 
>>>>>>>> attitude and patronizing policies.
>>>>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>>>>> Robert Hooper
>>>>>>>> Hooper.90 at buckeyemail.osu.edu
>>>>>>>> The Ohio State University
>>>>>>>> 0653 Buckeye-Cuyahoga CT
>>>>>>>> 653 Cuyahoga Court
>>>>>>>> Columbus, Ohio 43210
>>>>>>>> (740) 856-8195
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>>>>>>>> Behalf Of Mark J. Cadigan
>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 12:00 PM
>>>>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advice Requested
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I may just do that. But, I would rather not.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>> From: "Dan Weiner" <dcwein at dcwein.cnc.net>
>>>>>>>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog 
>>>>>>>> Users'"
>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 11:55 AM
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advice Requested
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Take the dog behind the chain, then and if there is a problem you 
>>>>>>>>> can say
>>>>>>>>> that the ODS office has given you no choice because of their
>>>>>>>>> obstructionist
>>>>>>>>> behavior.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> They really don't sound nice, my god
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> In my opinion, take your dog where it's convenient for you and 
>>>>>>>>> fornicate
>>>>>>>>> them if they don't like it.
>>>>>>>>> Easy for me to say right--smile--I'm not the one who has to live 
>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>> this.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> But I just find it unconscionable, after all training with your 
>>>>>>>>> first dog
>>>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>>>> so stressful and now to have this idiocy you have to deal with.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Dan
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] 
>>>>>>>>> On Behalf
>>>>>>>>> Of Mark J. Cadigan
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 11:48 AM
>>>>>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>>>>>>>> Cc: President at NAGDU.ORG
>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advice Requested
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thank you to everyone for your response.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> My dog does not mind pavement relieving. The patch of pavement I 
>>>>>>>>> am using
>>>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>>>> public property and not owned by the school. I believe all the 
>>>>>>>>> school is
>>>>>>>>> doing is blowing hot air.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> There is no grass available for several blocks, and the area is 
>>>>>>>>> not safe
>>>>>>>>> after about 10:00pm. The location I am currently using is well 
>>>>>>>>> lit, and
>>>>>>>>> visible to the officers at the security desk of my dorm.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> What kinds of modifications can the school require I make to my 
>>>>>>>>> dog's
>>>>>>>>> relieving practices? He is going on the shoulder of the rode, in a 
>>>>>>>>> sort of
>>>>>>>>> inlet that leads down an alley. There is a chain across the alley 
>>>>>>>>> that if
>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>> passed it I would be on private property. I don't go passed the 
>>>>>>>>> chain.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I am removing 95% or higher of every deposit. They are still 
>>>>>>>>> griping at me
>>>>>>>>> for when due to no fault of my own, some remnants get stuck to the
>>>>>>>>> pavement
>>>>>>>>> witch can't be removed.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> There is also a trash can within 20ft of this patch of pavement I 
>>>>>>>>> deposit
>>>>>>>>> the bagged waist in this trash receptacle.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> This is the policy and procedure recommended by Fidelco. The 
>>>>>>>>> school is
>>>>>>>>> threatening to write me up for a violation of the ODS amendment to 
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> student handbook. This section does not specify a punishment, so 
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> punishment would be at the discretion of the school.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I am not the first student to have a guide dog on campus, however, 
>>>>>>>>> I am
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> only one the ODS office has decided to harass. There is another 
>>>>>>>>> student in
>>>>>>>>> my dorm with a guide dog. However her dog is much smaller than my 
>>>>>>>>> dog,
>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>> a corresponding reduction in size of its deposit. This student 
>>>>>>>>> takes her
>>>>>>>>> dog
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> behind the aforementioned chain onto private property. I am not
>>>>>>>>> comfortable
>>>>>>>>> in doing this without the consent of the property owner. I am 
>>>>>>>>> unable to
>>>>>>>>> determine the property owner; however, I believe it is owned by 
>>>>>>>>> either the
>>>>>>>>> state or federal government. The property belongs to either a 
>>>>>>>>> courthouse
>>>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>>>> office building or perhaps both.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thank you for your help,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Mark
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/dcwein%40dcwein.cnc.net
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>>> for nagdu:
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nagdu mailing list
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>>>>> nagdu:
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>>>>
>>>>
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>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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