[nagdu] Equipment was RE: Changing the rules when you get home

Sat Aug 24 10:42:41 UTC 2013

Prong collars are great for me. I compare it to using a double bridle or 
a more severe bit on a horse. You can get a lot of very precise control 
if they're used well, fitted right, etc. I find, and this is just me, 
that I can actually feel my dog's head movements better with a prong 
than with a gentle leader.

Pinch collars don't freak people out nearly as much as talking about 
using electronic training collars. Again, really great tool if used 
correctly, but really bad one otherwise. I used one with my Weimaraners 
when I did obedience trials with them, so I could better proof certain 
exercises, and I remember there used to be a lot of heated debate on 
both sides.

Shanna and Diamond, who gets excited to wear her prong collar
On 8/23/2013 7:43 PM, Nicole Torcolini wrote:
> A lot of people I know get freaked out when people talk about pinch collars,
> but I don't think that it is that much of a deal. The bottom line is that
> any equipment can be misused; it's just sometimes easier to inadvertently
> misuse certain equipment than others.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Doug Parisian
> Sent: Friday, August 23, 2013 4:45 PM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Changing the rules when you get home
>
> Guess I've never thought of myself as changing the rules, but rather doing
> what I have found to be best for my dog, myself, and working both of us into
> the particular environment.  In Winnipeg, this can mean "gunning it" across
> intersections so as not to be standing with my dog's bare feet on cold
> cement when the temperature is minus 30 and my bus, which runs once every
> half hour, is at the stop where I want to board.  So, according to some
> ego-centric trainers (and there are at least one or two) I've broken all
> their hard work in terms of traffic checks.  Truth is, my reason for working
> with a dog guide is not primarily to keep me safe in traffic, but rather to
> find the best path, to avoid living or dead obstacles, etc.  When I am
> exposed to the panicked traffic lectures at my school,, it's time for a
> brief nap.
>
> And indeed, I have found the pinch collar works out for several reasons, one
> of which is to keep the busy-body segment of the public out of my hair.  It
> takes very little action from a properly used pinch collar to get the dog
> back on focus.  Be warned though that if miss-used, the pinch collar can
> also cause serious pain and harm.  The dogs where I've used the pinch collar
> have no fear of it, but they do behave a little better when it's on and that
> carries over to the regular choker.
>
> Doug: why is my dog's neck so thin?
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Howard J. Levine" <WB2HWW at earthlink.net>
> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, August 23, 2013 6:15 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Changing the rules when you get home
>
>
> : Right on I agree with you 100 percent, I live in New York can't stop, must
> : get out of street as fast as you can. You just do what works for you.
> :
> : -----Original Message-----
> : From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Raven Tolliver
> : Sent: Friday, August 23, 2013 12:19 PM
> : To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
> : Subject: Re: [nagdu] Changing the rules when you get home
> :
> : I changed a lot more than just the rules.
> : One of the first things I did was put the choke chain to rest, and switch
> to
> : a prong collar. I did not like the chain because frequently, it got caught
> : in my golden's fur, and it would turn around and slide down his neck. I
> : could never keep it in a proper position for a leash correction. I also
> did
> : not like the idea of briefly choking my dog for a leash correction. So for
>
> a
> : couple months, I used the prong collar, and it worked much better for me.
> : Then, I just switched to the martingale check collar, which is what I use
> : now.
> : I don't remember if my school said to heel the dog off of a bus or not.
> : Regardless, I work him off the bus. I gauge how much of a step down there
> is
> : by his behavior. If he steps right off after being cued to go forward,
> : there's obviously not much of a step. But if he stops in the doorway, and
> : does not obey the cue "forward," I know that there is a larger step down.
> : The school did say not to have the dog lay down on the bus. I don't think
> : this is practical, especially for longer bus rides. It doesn't come
> : naturally for my dog to just sit up while the bus is moving, so he just
> lays
> : down, and I slide him back under the seat. If someone comes on with a
> : wheelchair, stroller, or cart, I briefly grab up his front paws.
> : The school taught us to switch the dog over to the right side when working
> : through doors that opened out to the left. The only time I'll maneuver
> : through a doorway by doing a complete 360 is when I am carrying things in
> my
> : right hand.
> : I stopped treating so frequently concerning curbs and stairs. The school
> had
> : us treating at every curb, which is just ridiculous, especially the way
> they
> : had us stopping at the curb when we reached the other side of the street.
> : They trained the dog to stop with its front paws on the curb, but you and
> : the rest of your dog would still be hanging out in the road. I'm sorry,
> but
> : I did not like that at all.
> : Not all roads have bike lanes to just hang out in, and you only have about
> : 20-30 seconds to get your butts across the road and out of the road. So I
> : allowed my dog to continue over the curb, and just verbally praised him
> for
> : it. It's just not necessary to stop in the street after crossing the road.
> : At stairs, I allowed him to go up stairs without stopping at them.
> : Usually, he stops at stairs whether they are going up or down, but if he
> : does not stop, I don't rework it because I personally can feel through my
> : harness whether my dog is stepping up or down.
> : Too, when crossing streets, the school discouraged any kind of automatic
> : turning after crossing. If we needed to make a turn, we were instructed to
> : take two or three steps after the curb, cue "wait," then cue our dogs left
> : or right. Again, not practical, at least, not in my environment. On
> campus,
> : there isn't a lawn on the street side of the sidewalk, so turns after
> : crossing have to be immediate. I have to cue my dog "to the curb, right.
> To
> : the curb, right," or else, we will pass up the turn.
> : I also changed my dog's diet. He is now on a fish-based, grain, gluten,
> and
> : soy-free dog food. And I started feeding my dog fruit -- cantaloupe,
> : honey-do, and pear. He has never been interested in vegetables.
> : When I lived with my parents, I did not let him off leash until his
> : off-leash recall was reliable. And I did not force him to sleep on his bed
> : or in his crate. He was restricted to sleeping in my bedroom with me, but
> : the spot was up to him. He never got up on the bed, since he considered
> : jumping up on the furniture a sin. Here in my apartment, he sleeps
> wherever
> : - in the bathroom, living room, somewhere in the bedroom. The spot is up
> to
> : him and he moves around throughout the night.
> : He has never had an accident indoors. My puppy-raisers even said that he
> : never had an accident with them, even when he was sick. But sometimes, I
> : will take him out if I wake up around two or three in the morning though.
> : Oh, and lastly, I got him several squeaky toys. I don't know why schools
> say
> : not to get them. Maybe because dogs will try to chew the squeakers out and
> : eat them? My golden guy loves his squeaky toys, and I always monitor him
> if
> : he's playing independently with anything but a Nylobone.
> :
> :
> : --
> : Raven
> :
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