[nagdu] Guide Dog School

Tue Mar 10 22:24:00 UTC 2015

I have heard very positive and very negative things about every school
out there.  I think it is important to ask questions, do research and
determine which school will best fit your needs.  I agree that we, as
consumers, should let the schools know what we want in a dog.  I have
always gone to Leader Dogs for my dog guides and when I began going
there the dog was signed over to me when I completed the program.
That changed by the time I went for my 4th dog and has changed again
since then.  I understand why people have concerns about the school
maintaining ownership for a period of time.  I have never had any
issues so that is not a big concern for me.  I have also seen well
trained and not well trained dogs from all of the schools.  And, quite
honestly, I have been with people who had a well trained dog but did
not maintain the training so the dog was not under control.  If you
are happy with the school that provides your dog then continue with
that school.  The great thing is that if any of us are unhappy, for
any reason, with a school, we have many schools to choose from.

On 3/10/15, S L Johnson via nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Hello:
>
> I prefer ownership too.  However, I can understand why some schools are
> concerned about the dog's health and weight.  I've seen some extremely
> overweight guide dogs, some as much as ten to twenty pounds too heavy.
> This
> can cause all kinds of health problems.  It also looks horrible to the
> public.
>
> I have to object to your statement about Pilot Dogs.  You said you don't
> like where they get their dogs.  They have their own breeding program for
> most of the breeds they use, otherwise they obtain dogs from breeders.  For
> example, they do not breed their golden retrievers but get them from
> reliable breeders.  My dog is a perfect temperament and very intelligent.
> She is very well behaved and very   well trained.
>
> Oh, by the way, be careful with Guide Dog Foundation.  They put my last dog
> Tara out even though they knew she had hip dysplasia.  Tara also developed
> cataracts, that resulted from hereditary cysts in her eyes.   She was only
> six years old.  So, if you want to question the quality of dogs, think of
> getting a dog with health issues.
>
> I think the important thing we can learn from this discussion is that we
> have a lot of work to do in order to get the guide dog schools to do a
> better job of breeding, raising and  training.  They should be willing to
> respect us and to welcome our input as to what we want from the school and
> the dogs we receive.  Even those schools that have graduate councils only
> select grads for the council who will agree with everything the director
> and
> board wants.  We need grad councils who will speak up and disagree when
> they
> don't like what is happening.
>
> One final point.  Whether you are getting your first dog or a successor
> dog,
> it is important to be a good consumer.  Fortunately with the internet, it
> is
> very easy to check out the web sites for all the schools.  Discussion lists
> like this one are also an excellent source of information.  I know many
> people are loyal to their schools but, times change so, that school might
> not be your best choice.  Last year when I knew it was time for Tara to
> retire, I applied to several schools.
>
> Sandra and Eva
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Nimer Jaber via
> nagdu
> Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2015 2:04 PM
> To: milissa61; 'Debby Phillips'; 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National
> Association of Guide Dog Users'
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Guide Dog School
>
> Hi all,
>
> Thanks for your responses about the various guide schools.  I am in
> agreement with Marion on his points...I don't like a school that will
> retain
> ownership for any amount of time.  I don't like a school that mandates
> weight requirements, and I certainly don't like a school that attempts to
> force grads to send medical info.  This is just like going out and buying a
> car and having the dealership tell you that they wish to see a log of all
> the places you go with that car.  This isn't something I'm willing to
> accept.  As it stands, it seems that most schools retain ownership.  There
> seems to be only a couple of schools that purport to hand over ownership to
> their grads.  It's a shame that things are going down the way they are with
> TSE as I support their model the most and would love to pay for my dog.
> Looks like I'll be checking out GDF and GDA as they seem to be the ones
> that
> hand ownership.  I have heard and seen too many cases of pretty bad
> training
> with Pilot...and I don't like where they get their dogs from, either.
> Southeastern seems to have a forced retirement age that is in-congruent
> with
> providing ownership.  If anyone has anything additional to add about this,
> please let me know.  I wish that more schools would provide ownership and
> would stop treating blind people with such disrespect, but I suppose I can
> continue dreaming...
>
> Thanks all for all of your advice on this topic.
>
> On 09-Mar-15 10:29, milissa61 wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> All my dogs have been from Guiding Eyes. They are a great school and
>> the director of training is phenomenal. When you get a dog from
>> Guiding Eyes, GEB owns the dog for the first two years. After that,
>> you are able to apply for ownership provided your dog is in good
>> health. GEB is very strict about making sure their dogs are not over
>> weight. I like GEB's ownership policy because if anything goes wrong,
>> (like the dog is being abused) GEB can step in and take the dog. They
>> are not in the practice of taking people's dogs away. If something is
>> wrong, they really go out of their way to help you straighten things
>> out. But, I am glad it's an option. I've seen way to many dogs from
>> schools that give ownership right away not be able to do anything if a
>> dog is not being treated well or if the dog is overweight. Let me know if
> you have any other questions about GEB.
>>
>> Just my two cents.
>>
>> Milissa
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Debby
>> Phillips via nagdu
>> Sent: Monday, March 9, 2015 11:27 AM
>> To: nimerjaber1 at gmail.com; semisweetdebby at gmail.com; nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Guide Dog School
>>
>> You might want to look at Guiding EYES.  They produce some great dogs,
>> the training is very good, I'm told, (the Director of training was my
>> first instructor at Seeing Eye).  I'm not sure what their ownership
>> policy is.  I almost applied there before I got Neena, but at the last
>> moment, I just couldn't make the change.  I've been getting dogs from
>> TSE since 1981.  I have concerns too about some of the direction then
>> are going, and concerns about their ability to do good follow up.  But
>> for me, I just couldn't make the change.  Neena is a great dog, and I
>> love how she works.  We will see, in the future, if I need follow-up
>> if it will happen or not.  Good luck with your search.    Peace,
>> Debby with Neena
>>
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>
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-- 
Marianne Denning, TVI, MA
Teacher of students who are blind or visually impaired
(513) 607-6053