[Nfb-krafters-korner] what you are forgetting

Mon May 2 14:45:46 UTC 2011

Joyce;
Why didn't they state sold with in the NFBKK.  This would allow us to sell a copy to payed members only and the recordings would stay with in the KK membership.

Terry Powers

-----Original Message-----
From: Blindhands at aol.com [mailto:Blindhands at aol.com] 
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2011 3:39 PM
To: nfb-krafters-korner at nfbnet.org
Subject: Re: [Nfb-krafters-korner] what you are forgetting

Henrietta,

I appreciate and hear what you are saying.  I am sorry that this had  to be forced into this.  

Everyone is forgetting that the NFB Krafters  Division has not sold  nor have given these recordings to anyone except the people attending the classes.  The recordings were all done under NFB Krafters Division  name.  When there was a question regarding if members could purchase  recordings of classes that they did not attend and the teacher made the  statement that recordings of her classes are hers and if she wants to sell them  that is only her right.  It was totally blown up from there.  

At this point of time again no one on the board or behind anyone"s back have there been talk or plans about selling these recordings.  

I agree with you that these recordings are good for the people that have taken the class and would like to refer back to it, but I do not think they are  worth anything to anyone else.  

I would like to be able to put a blurb of a class on the website to promote  and let others hear an brief example of a class, but from what went on this list  in the past we felt we could not do that.  

I have had the wind in my sails blown away by what people here has blamed me of doing.  I can't believe I have been called a wolf in disguised clothing.  I think everyone here that has taken part in this mud slinging  should take a good look at themselves.  Maybe instead of thinking about  yourself and worrying if Krafters Korner is looking to make big bucks off of  you, I repeat we have not sold any of these recordings and have only given them  to the students that can attend the classes.  It was our decision to send recordings only to the people at the class to encourage people to come to a class and participate.  If you make the effort to atend a class that is the only thing a teacher gets out of their time.  Your support by showing  up.  
The Krafters Division encourages people to be a paid member and that  is done by allowing unpaid people to take their first class for free and then become a paid member in order to take as many classes as they want.

There will be a statement on the class sign up form coming in the near future stating the class recordings are not to be shared or given away or sold.  They are for the student's personal use only.[you get my idea, this might not be the exact wording.]

Henrietta, I don't think you need to worry.  I don't see these MP3 recordings hitting the pop charts and everyone rushing out to get it.

Joyce  Kane
_www.KraftersKorner.org_ (http://www.krafterskorner.org/) 
Blindhands at AOL.com   

In a message dated 4/30/2011 6:56:49 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, gary.brewer at comcast.net writes:

To me,  NFB Krafters was a place to learn new crafts and make friends for 
sure.   If the Karfters Korner wants to sell or use the mp3's of our chatting 
and  learning, it looks like they have that right. 

Teachers have the right  to decide whether they want their classes distributed to unknown people. They  just should not do classes for the Karfter's division.  

I think  that when you talked to your lawyers you forgot an important issue. Not only  do the teachers have a stake in what is distributed but the students will also  have their comments sold or used for whatever the division feels will help the  group.  I for one, can't feel good about interaction on a class if my  words will go down in mp3 history.  

The classes and chats have  always been like a knitting circle for me. I could be at home where I am  needed and join in with others that enjoy crafting.  If I misunderstand  and say something that sounds off the wall, I don't want it replayed and  replayed and maybe go places I am not in favor of.  

So, I for  one, can't feel good about speaking at classes from this time 
forward.   

As a division, you might want to go back to the lawyers and ask what  they feel is necessary to alert students to the fact that what they say can be sold or used as promotional information.

As you think of this one fact,  you might begin to realize that the lawyers could only advise you on the info  you gave them. That makes your decisions incomplete.

Did you think of  the fact that giving the mp3's to students would allow them to share with  anyone they choose.  There is no stopping this as you know. But when the  mp3's become something with monitery value people can have new ideas about how  to manage them. 

Unless you are in a class the recordings become  confusing and very boring. 
So the  money you will collect will probably  be minimal. I am not worried about what you will make on them. You are right.  The ten dollar fee is so small for all we gained. And probably I should have  been afraid to speak all along. But you have made it very clear to me  now.  

I guess every little sewing circle has the potential to  become big business. I am looking for a little sewing circle.
Henrietta On  Apr 30, 2011, at 4:23 PM, Blindhands at aol.com wrote:

> I am sorry you  feel this way.  This statement is what Attorney Brown
had 
>  suggested and approved.   We were forced to do this to clarify  the  NFB 
> Krafters
> Division responsibility for the  recordings. 
> 
> I  started this list, division and all that  Krafters Korner has to 
> offer solely to  have a place where blind  people can come and share 
> and learn
how to 
> continue
> doing  crafts.  It was a friendly place to email, call up and  talk to
folks 
> about how they do crafting without sight.  It moved  forward  and I 
> was thrilled when Laurie offered to do  beading classes and we  
> researched how to do conference call  classes.  It was all a bunch of  
> friends having a good
time  doing
> this no matter where you lived.  I went  forward with  starting this 
> division so we could reach out to more people  that  are blind.  I 
> have
spread the 
> word
> every way  I could and put my love of  crafting first.  Other folks 
> here joined in with me to make this a unique  place for blind people.
> 
> We have spread and grown and people  from different  time zones have 
> expressed their wishes to be able to be part of   Krafters Korner and be 
included in 
> the
> chances of  participating in  classes.  I have listened and tried to
figure  
> out ways to accommodate  all. 
> 
> All we ask is  $10 per year for folks to enjoy all of the  benefits.    
If  
> we were the money hungry souls that people have  blamed us for  being, 
> we would be
> charging people for every class they   take.  We would not be offering 
MP3  
> files for them to keep  and listen  to.  Go out and take a class in 
> the
real 
>  world
> and you pay big bucks for  it.  You miss a class and  it is too bad 
> for
you. 
> They don't provide  you with  anything.  The teachers here give their
time 
> up
> to you  for  free.  They give you extra time during the week or via 
> email

> whenever you  need it.  The list is open 24 hours a day to  answer 
> your questions.
> 
> It took a few people  to start this uproar and  point the finger at 
> NFB Krafters  Division.  The teachers wanted the right  to do what 
> they want
with  
> their
> class recordings.  This statement  clarifies  what the division's 
> rights
are 
> and if you look into the meaning  behind  this statement I believe the 
> teachers can get  their answer too.  The  teachers can check this out 
> with their lawyers.
> 
> Many of you  have forgotten what the  Krafters Korner primary mission 
> is
all 
> about.  It  is a  place to learn and share how blind people can craft 
> and
be 
> creative.  
> It is a place to make friends and share our love of   crafting.  It is a 
> place for blind people to get together and  share  creative ideas with
other 
> blind
> people.   Some  individuals seem to have forgotten why this was started.  
It  
> had  nothing to do with the NFB Krafters Division making  money.  It 
> was
to  
> encourage
> the talent and  creativity of the blind and this remains the same  
> today, this  has not changed, making a buck is not what we are here  for.
>  
> Joyce Kane
> _www.KraftersKorner.org_  (http://www.krafterskorner.org/) 
> Blindhands at AOL.com  _______________________________________________
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